How to Help Your Teen Find Their Spark

Every teen has a spark inside them—something that makes them come alive.
 But too often, they get lost trying to be who the world wants them to be.

In this episode, I talk with my good friend Arthur C. Woods, author of SPARK for Emerging Leaders. He shares simple ways parents can help their teens discover who they want to be, not just what they want to do.

We talk about:
 👉 Why purpose matters more than perfection
 👉 How to help your teen take ownership of their choices
 👉 The role of mentors, coaches, and parents in lighting that spark
 👉 What real leadership looks like for teens today

This is a short, powerful conversation that will inspire you to see your teen in a new light—and remind you that your job isn’t to push them, but to help them shine.

✨ Get Arthur’s book, SPARK for Emerging Leaders, on Amazon or at sparkforemergingleaders.com

💡 Learn more about coaching with Ben at benpughcoaching.com

Are You Caught in the Parent Trap?

Discover the hidden patterns that are keeping you stuck—and how to break free.

Take this quick (and eye-opening) quiz to uncover which common parenting trap you’re falling into with your teen.
Get a personalized roadmap to help you parent with more clarity, confidence, and connection—starting today.

https://benpughcoaching.com/parenttrapquiz

Transcript

Ben: 0:00

I'm Ben Pugh and you're listening to IMPACT! Parenting with Perspective. This podcast is all about helping parents manage the mental and emotional drama that comes with parenting teens so they can focus on what's most important. Building rock solid relationships and having a powerful impact on their teen's life. Join me each week as I dive into real tools to help you and your teen turn struggles into strengths. All right, everyone, welcome back to the podcast. Thank you for, thank you for taking time outta your day to come hang out with me. I, it's a great privilege and honor to get to hang out with you. So thank you for being here. today. I have a long time friend. He's actually been on the podcast before, years. I don't even know when that is. I should go check, but it was at least a couple years ago. Yep. Arthur C. Woods, does anyone call you by like your full name plus your middle initial, or is that just me?

Arthur: 1:08

Like when they're introducing me, but like if we're having just a one-on-one conversation, no one's saying Arthur C. Woods, that would be pretty.

Ben: 1:16

Weird. I do it because it just sounds like a superhero name, like Arthur C. Wood. Like I never thought of it that way. Do you know freaking Arthur C. Woods and people, Arthur C. Woods? Yeah, I've read his book. It's amazing now. Exactly. That's what,

Arthur: 1:34

that's what always happens.

Ben: 1:35

Yeah. Yeah. So Arthur took over my podcast years ago on my birthday and basically was like. The guest co-host, and that was a lot of fun. We should maybe do that again.

Arthur: 1:48

Yeah, that was cool. Interviewing the podcast host on his podcast.

Ben: 1:53

Yeah.

Arthur: 1:54

Takeover.

Ben: 1:55

I know. Takeover. Or it could be viewed as slightly lazy, like seriously, Arthur, go make your own podcast. Exactly. Exactly.

Arthur: 2:04

It could be, it could be that. Not sure.

Ben: 2:07

real quick though. So the reason I have Arthur on my podcast. he also, you work primarily with teens, right?

Arthur: 2:16

So I work with teenagers, I work with adults, work with young adults, work with parents. And uh, what your audience probably doesn't know is you were like my original. Coaching mentor. When I was just starting this out a number of years ago, I went to Ben and was like, Ben, help me. What do I do? And I learned, uh, quite a bit from you. So all the, all the success that I have today. Whatever that is, I owe it all to

Ben: 2:48

you. Oh, wow. Yeah. Well, uh, I'm, I just feel bad, like maybe I could have pointed you in the direction of a better mentor somewhere.

Arthur: 2:59

No, I was so glad that I got to start out with you. That was, uh, that was great.

Ben: 3:03

Well, that was fun. That was back in the, um, my gosh, what Clubhouse

Arthur: 3:08

app? Yes. Oh my goodness. I forgot about Clubhouse. That's exactly right. The clubhouse. The Clubhouse app. I think that's where I first found you was was talking on Clubhouse and yeah,

Ben: 3:19

me and my buddy Joey Massio talking about life coaching for parents and teens and how to be a good life coach. I've actually, so I have a bunch of former clients that are. Dipping their toes in the waters of life coaching. And a handful of people have reached out and they're like, dude, so some people are certified through the life coach school, which is where I'm certified from. And they're like, I don't feel like they've really taught me how to coach like you coach. And I'm like, well,'cause I have my own specific blend. My specific blend is like follow your gut, make stuff up and just live on the fly. And it worked for me, but I've had multiple people ask like, Hey, would you teach me some of your secrets? So maybe I'll do a podcast episode where I share some of the secrets that I feel have really helped me kind of. I don't know, be my, I'm not like uber successful guys. I just, I'm a regular guy, but I do feel like I'm a pretty good life coach, so maybe one of these days. Maybe you can come take over my podcast. Yeah. And we'll do the Ben's top tips for not being a boring life coach.

Arthur: 4:43

Yeah, I'd love that. Yeah, let's do it. But it, you know, to, to your point, it's interesting because a lot of times if you're getting trained on being a coach, there's the, the people that want to train you on how to do the actual coaching and you need that. And then there's the people that want to train you on the business and marketing. A side of of coaching and you need that too. So it's kind of like how do you, how do you combine, how do you combine both? Yeah.

Ben: 5:07

So not too long ago I saw a Facebook post, and not only are you like an international speaker. Are you international?

Arthur: 5:19

International? No, no. I almost got a job in Canada, which would have made me international, but yeah, couldn't, couldn't make it work at the last minute.

Ben: 5:29

Gotcha.

Arthur: 5:29

So

Ben: 5:30

still international, super spy. Only a national speaker and now an author and I, yeah, so I was number one. I was excited to see that, but number two, I was just like instantly jealous, like holy cow. Arthur is a speaker and a writer. I gotta catch up. I need you to come mentor me so I can just like get caught. Like I'm a podcaster. That's like the extent of my, my skills.

Arthur: 6:04

My skills. I just go on other people's podcasts. Yeah. That's just, yeah,

Ben: 6:10

that's the way to do it is easier that way. So let me talk to you. So the book is called Spark. I've got it here. Spark for Emerging Leaders. I'm curious, number one, how long have you wanted to write a book and what was kind of that process?

Arthur: 6:31

Yeah. Well, I wanted to write a book for, for many years, as I think a lot of people do. And a number of years ago, I read a book called Spark by uh, the author Dr. Tracy Jones, and I loved it. And it was this framework for how to discover, how to kind of focus down on what's most important to you and then how to accomplish that in your life. And I read the whole thing and I thought not only was this great for me personally, but this has so many implications for teenagers. And so I reached out to Dr. Jones and said, Hey, you don't know me, but I just read your book, and what would you think about working with me on your version of the book specifically for teenagers? And she loved the idea. I loved the idea. We went back and forth and, and, uh, over the next couple years or so, we kind of, exchanged a lot of Zoom calls and emails and, and meeting in person and suddenly. I got the, the green light to write the book based on her original concept, the, the spark framework that's talked about in the book, and we just released it in, uh, in the beginning of August. And so it takes her original content that was so power, so, so impactful, and then it contextualizes it to a teenage audience so that it can be just as impactful and just as, as transformational.

Ben: 7:58

Yeah, I'm seeing a pattern here. You hijack people's podcast and uplevel them, like, let's be honest, and then you hijack people's books and like uplevel them.

Arthur: 8:12

That, that's all that that, I guess that's, I have no original thought here, Ben. Yeah.

Ben: 8:18

All the people listening to this podcast, you're like, man, be nice to this guy. Yeah, I'll be nicer. I, I hear that here. Here's the thing about the book that I was impressed with, so I don't know if everyone realizes this, but I am a former teenager, like, believe it or not, I was a teenager years ago. Okay. Listeners of this podcast, you get that, but like I coach high school football, I'm the head freshman football coach, and some of those kids legitimately believe like I wrote a dinosaur to school. They, they just have no concept of years and time. But as a former teenager and specifically as a former knucklehead teen who hated reading, I think you could have gotten me to read this book because it's super short, like 70 pages. Yep. My only complaint is there's no pictures and yeah. I stick figures. Just your gosh, I gotta be nicer. Can I tell you though, one of the things that I really liked were the questions that you had at the end of each chapter. I, I thought that was fantastic. Like, if you could get a team to read this book, especially as a former high school principal, like my stance on suspending kids is different than most principals. Like my goal is to, I don't care how big a knucklehead you are, I want to keep you in school, and I want to get you to the point that you're like, man. I am so sick of Mr. Pugh. I don't want to hang out with him all day. What can I do to get back in class? And if I were a principal again reading this book, I would make it one of the things to earn your way back into class. Like how can you start taking advantage of some of these principles and start being the type of person that you want to be? Yeah. So why don't you walk us through Spark, what it stands for, how it applies to teenagers, and most people listening to my podcast, hopefully they're not teenagers. I've gotten feedback from teenagers. I've had a couple of teen clients that they're like, oh, my mom made me listen to your podcast, and it sucks. It's boring. Parents, don't make your teens listen to this podcast. It's not as helpful as you think it is. But you can be the change that you want to see and it's more inspirational. So if you can like give us a take for how this could benefit teams. But also work in this Spark framework and show us how it can benefit parents.

Arthur: 11:09

Yeah, ab absolutely. And, and that's the great thing about the framework because it originally was written for, for adults. So it is very relevant to, to us. And now with the new book, we've got a version that is very relevant to teenagers. So the Spark framework really just starts out with. The word singularity. S for singularity. What is, what is that primary focus? What's that thing we're working toward? You know, I always say when, when we were little kids, we were often asked, what do you want to do when you grow up? And that's an important question. That's a good question. But how often were we asked, who do you want? To be, and that's a very different question, one that, that we don't really get asked often. In fact, even as adults, how often have we given that? A lot of thought. And so the first chapter of Spark prompts us to figure out who do we want to be? What do we want to do? What is most important for us? Right now. And that's not to say that we have to have it all figured out right now as a teenager, and that that will never change, of course. But, it's so even whether you're in middle school, high school, college, to take the time to ask those questions, who do I want to be? What do I want to do and how do I focus in on that thing? What's that? Singularity?

Ben: 12:30

Yeah. One of the reasons I love this book so fast, like immediately as I'm reading it, I'm like, dang, singularity. That is very similar to what I teach about just how unique and singular you are as a person, but also. The importance of taking some time and defining who do I want to be and when I talk to parents, I do this with teens too, but for parents, the big thing is. Take a minute, come up with a 10 word vision statement for you and your parenting, and that will kind of act like GPS to help you be the parent of your dreams. And I always tell parents, like for GPS to work, you have to know where you want to go and where you are right now if you're short. Either of those components. GPS doesn't work. And for teenagers, so I work with a lot of elite high school athletes. I also work with a lot of knuckleheads. You're kind of on that reign somewhere. And one of the most impactful things when we can get to the point of like, who do you want to be? Yeah. And how like when you get in trouble, typically you are not being the type of teenager or the type of person you want to be. Where's that disconnect? Yeah. How can we get you to be who you want to be? And I thought that portion on Singularity was spot on. Like no one can be you. And if you're not being the you that you wanna be, the world's missing out and you're missing out. Yeah. I love that. Oh, keep going.

Arthur: 14:18

Yeah, I just, you know, I had a, I had a, a team client once and when I, we had this initial discussion.'cause in my, my coaching, this is usually where we begin, who do you want to be? And his, his response to that is, I want to be an NFL player. And I was like, great, but who do you want to be? There's that tendency to jump to the, the what do you want to do thing, but, and. And, and he was a great high school football player and there were things that we could do to help him get, to his, his professional career goals. But we took, went back and said, yeah, but who do you want to be? Whether or not you ever get in the NFL? Who do you want to to be? And then we had him create a 10 word statement, an identity statement that talked about who he he wants to be and let that kind of impact his trajectory. And uh, I Will he make the NFL? I don't know. Maybe he will. Maybe he won't, but he knows who he wants to be and that is arguably more important.

Ben: 15:22

Yeah. I teach a concept called the T chart of control. All my concepts, like they sound really cool. They're so simple. Seriously, you draw a T chart on the left hand side, you write down all the things that I can control on the right hand side are all the things that I cannot control. Yeah. Working with elite athletes. Whether you get into the NFL, the NBA, go to college, so many of these are outside of your control and like you could lose both your legs and like, yeah, I don't know, a portal that you stick your legs through and then the portal closes and just legs gone. Lost

Arthur: 16:03

me. You lost me there. Yeah. Have you ever played where We don't have, I say I'm from Pennsylvania, we don't have opening and closing portholes portals that

Ben: 16:12

I play video games with my 1-year-old sometimes and it affects my imagination. No, that's no problem. Yeah. But seriously, like whether or not playing the NFL is outside of your control. Yep. But if you can use kind of the GPS analogy and be like, well, I know that's. Where I want to go now, who do I need to be in the moment? And you could take it deeper. Like if you weren't in the NFL, who would you be? How would you work? What would you focus on? What would you eat? How do you sleep? Like all this stuff. Yeah. And the secret is start being that today. So we could spend like half an hour on each of these letters. Oh yeah. And how many letters? 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. That'd be at least two and a half hours. We can't do that. That's a little long. Yeah. Let's talk about persistence.

Arthur: 17:04

Yeah, so once you've kind of dialed down into your singularity, this is, this is who you want to be, this is what you want to do, this is what's most important to you. Then the P in spark is, like you said, Ben, persistence. What are the things that you not only have to do, but you really have to be persistent at? if you decide that you want to be a great guitar player, you've. Got to practice and practice and stick with it even when it's hard, even when it's boring, even when it's not fun, even when you'd rather do something else. You know, I use the example of, of me actually writing this book. This book is out because I was persistent in the writing of it, and I'm not, I'm not tapping myself on the shoulder saying, look at me. I'm the, the epitome of persistence. I actually use it as an example because I can't tell you how many times where. As much as I wanted to write the book, there's those times where it's like, all right, I've got the next three hours blocked out to write it, and I'm like, oh, I don't want to write right now, or I want to be doing something else, or something shiny just went by. I'd rather rather go look at that. The only reason the book is out is because most of the time. Not all the time. Most of the time I didn't go after that shiny object and I put my head down and I did what I needed to do. And that's what, whether we're adults or whether we're talking about teenagers, that's what we all have to do to get the things done that we want to get done. We have to be persistent. We have to stick with it and it'll, it'll get done.

Ben: 18:46

Yeah, I think another word for persistent, which obviously wouldn't fit with the acronym Spark. Stubbornness. Like, are you stubborn enough? That's good. I like that to stick with it. Yep. And I feel like a lot of parents actually, do you remember way back when we were kids and people would be like, oh, I'll tell you what's wrong with this generation. And they like, I got everything wrong. Well, I feel like we do the same thing. We just crap on the younger generation and people are like, I'll tell you what's wrong with these guys. They don't have persistence. Like I haven't heard anyone use like persistence, but they'll talk about like, they don't have sticktoitiveness, they don't have determination, they don't have the resilience to come back time and time and time again. And I'll have parents talk to me about that and I'll be like, yeah, but is your kid stubborn? And they're like, oh my goodness. Like they, when they get their mindset, I'm like, that's the same skill. And if they have that skill. Yeah. In one area of their life, even if it's video games or even it's, if it's in like not eating good food, that's my second oldest. He is very persistent in not eating vegetables. Great. If they have the skill in one area of their lives, you can help them start building that skill in other areas of their lives. Yeah, and I think if we can reframe it from like, man, this generation like. It's not fair when we're like, yeah, this generation has zero persistence and they're so freaking stubborn. It's like, well, either they got it or they don't.

Arthur: 20:31

They they got it or they don't. Right?

Ben: 20:32

Yeah. Now let's help'em apply it in a way that's appropriate.

Arthur: 20:37

Yeah. Yeah. I love that because that word stubborn almost always has a negative connotation with it. But I love the idea of kind of stealing the word back and saying, you know what? If you can be stubborn about this. You can be stubborn about that, and that's a good thing. You know, if you can be stubborn about your video games, you can also be stubborn about becoming the person that you want to be. Yeah. You're just gonna do it.

Ben: 21:01

Yeah. I'd say that we changed the title of the book right now, from Spark to Susar. This

Arthur: 21:06

aar. Yes, yes. Yeah. Or maybe we'll just switch it all to SS words and it'll just be,

Ben: 21:12

yeah. Oh, that's a thought. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Now. I really liked the A component, this part. Yeah. The books for teens. But this part I feel like is helpful knowledge for parents. And when parents come and hire people like you and me to work with their teens, they're looking for an advocate. Yeah. And I feel like, man, I'm gonna make. Some of the therapists that listen to this podcast, I feel like therapists are trying to get the monopoly on like, no, we are the only ones who can be advocates. And one of the number one reasons that I continue to coach high school football after all of these years, and kids are just getting more and more frustrating because they don't have persistence and they're so freaking stubborn, like they just piss you off. Just joking, but. I remember the impact that my coaches had in my life, and if you as a parent can help your teenager identify impactful and positive. People in their lives that can advocate for them. Yeah. I, I, my wife and I did foster care for 10 years. Yep. I feel like in foster care, like you have the state who says they're looking out for the kids' good, but really the state just wants to cover their back and like. Perform a role and the schools and the court and the parents and all these people are fighting for what they think is best for them. And oftentimes the person with like the least voice, the foster kid has no advocates. And that was like when my wife and I learned like, man, this is what it means to advocate. And sometimes you gotta fight. Yeah. So talk to us about the A in Cesar. Or,

Arthur: 23:17

yeah. I, and, and I love this, I love this section too because one of the things that I believe very firmly, and I I coach this with my clients, my adult clients and my teen clients, is the idea of the proximity principle. This idea that the people with whom you spend the most time tend to be the people you become the most like, and so as, as a teenager or as an adult, but as a teenager. It becomes really important for them to figure out, okay, who are the people in my life I need to be spending the most time with? Because, because if I spend time with these positive, healthy, quality people, it's gonna help me become who I want to be. And so I usually look at advocates first and foremost is, look at your parents. Yeah. They're your parents. First and foremost, your parents will be your greatest advocates. Use them as such, but then look around the rest of your relational world. Your athletic coach, your youth pastor, your teachers, your friends, a life coach like me or like you, who is whoever it is. A a coworker. A classmate. Who are the people in your life that if you surrounded yourself with these people. And allowed these people to advocate for you. It would help you achieve your singularity. It would put you on a trajectory to actually becoming who you want to be. And I agree with what you said earlier, Ben, that sometimes it seems like some professionals want it to be like, you know what I, I'll take, I got this Mom and dad, don't you, don't you worry about it. You drop your kid off with me. I'll spend an hour or two with them. And then I'll get them all squared away. And, uh, you just keep the, uh, you just keep the checks coming and we'll be, we'll be fine. And, and I think, no, like first and foremost, the family is the greatest advocate. And as a life coach, I want to be there, not just as an advocate for the teenager, but as an advocate for the parents, for the families, and making sure I am supporting the entire family and not just saying, I got this mom and dad, you don't have to worry about it because. Ultimately my relationship, my professional relationship with a student will end at some point when the coaching relationship ends, but the relationship with mom and dad and the family will go on, you know, forever.

Ben: 25:43

Yeah. As you were talking about that, I feel like early in my life coaching days, like I'm really good with teens. As a high school principal, I've coached a lot of football and the teen market. Was underserved, and so I feel like part of the reason I was able to make it coaching so quickly is that the teen market was underserved and people need people to coach teams that I'm like, well, here I am. The problem that I had with that is I felt like oftentimes it was the easy way out. Like, well, you want me to coach your team? Your team wants coaching. Mm-hmm. I can work with your team, but. The parent as the biggest advocates. Yeah. It's the parent who has the most impact on their teen's life. And just recently, I had a free consultation, just so you guys listening. Understand how I run my business. I don't have to work with people that I don't want to work with, and the people that I. Like working with the least are people who don't want coaching and don't want to work with me. And typically adults, if they don't wanna work with you, they're just not gonna pay for coaching and it's not a problem. Exactly. Teens, you got mom and dad that are willing to pay for coaching and they're like, no, you're gonna do coaching or else, and then you get this teenager who's there. Only there in body. It's not there in mind or spirit. Yeah. And not enjoying it. And so when I have these free consultations, oftentimes I'm feeling out the clients like, do I wanna work with this kid? Does he wanna work with me? And if I get the sense that, no, you're gonna be wasting your money trying to bring an advocate in to fix all your problems. Your teen probably isn't gonna put in the work. I don't want you to waste your money. I don't wanna waste your teen's time. And that's when we have the difficult conversation. Exactly. Which I believe is the most important one. Like how can I help you to have the relationship with your teen that your teen needs, so that you can be an impactful advocate in their life.

Arthur: 27:58

Yeah.

Ben: 27:59

So like I love working with teens. I will probably work with teens forever because I think there's some kids that only I can help. Like there's a special type of kid out there that gets in trouble for like lighting their school bus on fire and they're really good kids. They just do really dumb things. I can help those kids, but also like right now, I'm feeling a shift in my business as I'm like, man, I gotta do. More work to help more parents. And so yeah. I love that you have advocacy in there. I can't think of any s words that we could switch it to, so we'll just leave that one as it is. gosh, there was something else I was gonna say about advocates. And can't remember it, but teens, if your parents are making you listen to this podcast, first of all, I'm sorry. Second of all, go get you some good advocates. Oh, I just remembered what I was gonna say. It's gonna be funny and, and

Arthur: 28:54

I, I would argue if. If your parent, if you're a teenager and your parents are making you listen to this podcast, they are advocating for you.

Ben: 29:02

Yeah. They, they're doing the best that they know how. Yeah. uh, you were talking about the Law of Proximity, I think you called it. Yeah.

Arthur: 29:10

Yeah. The proximity principle. Sure.

Ben: 29:12

Oh yeah. Okay. And that's the one basically like you're the. Some average of like the five people that you spend the most time with. Yeah. I think I might have found what's wrong in my life. Like I spend the most time with teenage boys between the age of like 14 and 18. Maybe that's why I'm so childish. You gotta get out more. Yeah, there's, okay, well let's talk about the next one. I don't have it open to the right page, but I know how to spell spark. I know it starts with an R.

Arthur: 29:44

Yeah. R So R the R stands for resources and I, I always think back like to what the resources you and I would've had when we were kids. So at least for me it was before the internet. Uh, I was born in the late seventies, so holy. When I was first born, we, we even had exactly, we, we had black and white and we had color televisions. We didn't have a VCR, so on, on, uh, like Friday nights, we would go to the Mon Pa. video rental store, and we would rent a videotape and rent a VCR for the weekend, and then we'd have to bring them back for on on Monday. So it, it was, you know, there were no cell phones and all that. The resources you and I had back the day were not even close to the resources that teenagers have today. I couldn't have even. In, in my wildest science fiction fantasies couldn't have even imagined the resources realistically available to teenagers today with the internet, with ai, with smartphones and laptops and all these things. So as a teenager. Figures out their singularity, figures out, this is who I want to be, this is what I want to do. I need to persist at some things. They can surround themselves with the resources necessary to make them happen. And what's amazing is so many of these resources are inexpensive or even free. There's so much you can learn on on the internet. There's also a lot of junk on the internet, but that's another conversation for another time. But there's the, the way that you can resource yourself as a teenager is absolutely incredible. So you ask yourself, in light of my singularity, in light of who I want to be and what I want to do, what resources do I need to bring into my life? And if you don't have those resources, get them. And if you don't know how to get them, rely on your advocates to help you figure out how to get them. You need to be resourced.

Ben: 32:00

Yeah. first of all, when you were talking about how you couldn't have imagined the resources at kids' disposal at their fingertips, like even in your wildest sci-fi imaginations, I'm not impressed with your sci-fi imagination because I lost you at the portal thing and you're like, what? That's true. So like, maybe that's why No.

Arthur: 32:22

All I know is I watched the Jetsons when I was a kid and we were supposed to have robot maid and flying cars, and we're getting pretty close on the robots flying cars. I'm still not seeing too many of, so yeah, I'm a little, I'm a little let down.

Ben: 32:38

Yeah. And like back to the future, we haven't lived up to like hoverboards. We call'em hoverboards, but they do not hover.

Arthur: 32:46

Like they, that ain't a hoverboard. Yeah. Yeah. Anyone, anyone who's seen back to the future too, knows what a hover. Hover, excuse me, hoverboard is and, uh, we don't got'em.

Ben: 32:56

Yeah.

Arthur: 32:56

Yeah. So we've been lied to.

Ben: 32:59

Exactly. So this is one section of the book that I would've changed the title from resources to Resourcefulness and tell you the difference. So there was one point I was working with a gentleman named Jim Forton. One of my all time favorite coaches, he is just fantastic. And he would talk about how people let their resources, hold them back. Like, man, I can't afford to do this coaching program. I can't afford to get a life coach. I can't do this, I can't do that. And he talks about how resources are less important than being resourceful. Yeah, I like that. And one of the things that I teach. The teens that I work with, I, man, this is kind of a bad example, but I'm gonna go with it anyways. There's this young lady, just, she's fun, cool, intelligent, attractive. She's at Track Star and she's like, well, I don't have enough time to do my homework and I'm failing homework because, or I'm failing, or not failing, but I'm doing poorly in some of my classes because after school I have track. There's multiple teens in her house and she's like, well, my mom and dad each have a car and my older brother has the other car, so I have to walk home from track and it takes me 45 minutes to an hour. And I'm like, you have to walk home from track. And she's like, yeah, I just, I don't have a car so I have to walk home. And I'm like, I guarantee you there are at least 20 boys on your track team. That if you were like, Hey, anybody wanna gimme a ride home? They would all be like, oh, I'll take you. I'll take you instantly. And she's like, oh, I never thought of that. I was like, here's the thing, like you don't wanna lead'em on. You don't wanna be breaking any hard, it's like you just line'em out. Like, you can take me this day. You can take me this day. And like after that, see? I was able to completely solve her problem of not having enough time to do homework because she was being resourceful. That is resourceful. I can ask. I can, I have friends. I have these resources. It's up to me to use them. And since you're. Several years older than me. Many.

Arthur: 35:27

Clearly, I've outed my age now that I, I said what decade I was born in.

Ben: 35:32

I, I was born in 1981, the tail end of 1981. Anyways, remember MacGyver? Oh heck yeah. Like that dude didn't even, it didn't matter what the resources were. He could resourcefulness. Yeah, put it together, make it explode and like beat up the bad guys. Yep. That is the power of being resourceful and I feel like. Like, remember back when you and I were in school? do they have calculators back when you were in school?

Arthur: 36:03

Yes, I believe so. Yeah. Yeah, it was, it was called an Abacus. Yeah. We just moved, uh, yeah. Wait, what, what was that called? An abacus? Yeah. Where you just moved the little beads here and there and uh, yeah, yeah. Yes. We had calculators. I never had to use that,

Ben: 36:19

so I remember when they're like, guys. Don't use calculators. It's a resource and they're like, don't use'em because you're not gonna have a calculator in your pocket at all times. Like right. Looking back, like how stupid is it? Like we have the Jetsons, like we know the future's coming. Like can't we just trust in the power of calculators? I feel like adults to some extent are doing that Again. But with, yeah. Yes. And if I could teach a course, maybe you and I should like tag team a course one of these days and like, call it like intro to ai. How to cheat without achieving, like it's not really cheating guys. It's like using your personal assistant. Like Donald Trump doesn't write his own speeches, he doesn't do his own research, right? Like, why can't we empower kids to use their resources? And rather than being so afraid of the resources that they have at their finger fingertips, we need to actually take the time to teach them how to be resourceful in a way that's ethical and safe. Yeah.

Arthur: 37:28

Yeah. I, I like that. And I think the calculator is a good example, that we recognize that, you know what, maybe instead of fighting the calculator, we should have leaned into it. And as kids, we should have been allowed to lean into it because, I mean, we all have a calculator right here with us at all times. And so, yeah, I, I think you're right about AI being the same thing. We're almost afraid of it. No, it's cheating. It's cheating. It's like, no. It's always gonna be around. So why don't we learn how to use it? And like you said, safely and ethically, but how do we use it? How do we learn to use it? How do we lean into it in the same way that I could have done in the eighties with a calculator.

Ben: 38:11

Yeah. Yeah.

Arthur: 38:12

I had a calculator watch.

Ben: 38:14

Yeah, those are so I remember a friend having to take his watch off for a math test. Exactly. So worried. Anyways,

Arthur: 38:26

let's, well, I, I just, I mean, I know this has nothing to do with anything, but I just had to say it for the one listener who will be like, that's awesome. I had a Legend of Zelda watch, in which you could play a little Zelda video game on the watch, and I would sit in class and just play that the entire time. And it was wonderful.

Ben: 38:46

Yeah. And your,

Arthur: 38:47

that's all, that's all I have to say about that.

Ben: 38:49

Your teacher was probably like. Artie. Wait, what? What did your teachers call you back? Artie. Arthur Artie. Arthur C. Woods. Exactly. That's what they called me. Like whatcha doing on your watch? Like math stuff? Math. Math. It's all math, but in reality, the math stuff was on the left hand and the game. Well, I don't exactly. Yeah. Yeah, I I know what you were doing back then. Yeah. Okay. Let's talk about. Can knowledge. Can knowledge? Yes. Knowledge. Knowledge, knowledge.

Arthur: 39:24

Yeah. So the, the final part of the Spark framework is knowledge. what knowledge, what information do you need to know? Do you need to gather? Do you need to learn in order to help you become who you want to be? Do what you want to do in order to start achieving that singularity? And again, we have so much incredible. Free access to knowledge. There's almost nothing we can't learn at a moment's notice. And so once we figure out our singularity and we've made those commitments that we're gonna persist at these things and we've surrounded ourselves with advocates and resources or resourcefulness, we develop that skill, then it's alright, what's the knowledge that I need? And so we package that all together. And, and what I, what I hope is valuable about the book, and you brought this up earlier, Ben, is that at the end of each chapter. There's questions that get the student to think through what they just read and actually write down if they're willing to do it. Write down, alright, what's my singularity? What's important to me? What do I need to persist at? What knowledge do I need to gain? Who can I bring into my life? And in some cases, who do I need to remove from my life? Because we all have had those people in our lives, and they usually start when we're teenagers that I think. Boy, if I hadn't spent so much time with this person, life would have been, would've been better. And they're usually friends of ours that, you know. Yeah. I'm sure we both could tell stories.

Ben: 40:59

Um, yeah, I just went to my 25 year reunion and it was funny seeing some of those and thinking to myself, I'm glad I quit hanging out with them. Like, seriously? Yep.

Arthur: 41:10

Yep. Ex. Exactly. Yeah. So, so that's kind of it, that's the, that's the Spark framework and obviously the book goes into to more details about it, gives more examples and, and practical application and the opportunity for the, the student to kind of write out their own thoughts. And, uh, but that's in, that's it in a nutshell.

Ben: 41:31

Yeah. Let's talk about knowledge for a second because

Arthur: 41:33

yeah.

Ben: 41:34

Two of my least favorite answers have to do with. Knowing, when I was a principal, drove me nuts when I'd ask kids like, dude, what happened? They've been, I don't know. Or IDK, like, seriously? Yep. I don't know. And IDK, they're the same amount of syllables, like, just, you're not saving yourself any time here. And I would tell kids all the time, like, I don't know, just means I'm too lazy to think about that or to mm-hmm. Figure that out. Like, I'm not asking you like. A calculus question. I'm just asking you like, do you like it? Like what? Like it's a question that you're just being too lazy to gimme an answer. Exactly. And it's funny, so as a principal, I would have to introduce. People and like kind of do things when we'd have guest speakers and they asked me a question like, Hey, when does a bell ring or when's this class gonna get out? I said, I don't know. And it was like a chorus of teenagers. Like, that just means you too lazy, Mr. Pugh. Like, figure it out. I love it. That means you're on message. That's great. I love that. I'm like, yeah, thank you for using my own teachings against me, but so I can't stand it when teens say, I don't know. Here's the other thing. Currently, this happens all the time in football. My job as a football coach is to coach you up as a player. And if I try and coach you up and you just say, I know, I know. I know. You're not being coachable and you probably don't know because if you would've known, you would've done it the right way. And I feel like this chapter on knowing like we need to teach our kids the power of becoming knowledgeable, but also the power of. Being the empty cup. And I talked about the empty cup. Like if you already know that's like you're a full cup man. If I try and pour anything else into that, we'll go with Diet Dr. Pepper, because it's the best beverage ever. You're just gonna make a mess'cause it's just gonna spill all over. But if you can position yourself as an empty cup, and I've got some young men that. I have never played football before and I have some young men that have played football for years and one of these guys that's never played before, he is an empty cup. He is like, coach, fill me with knowledge. Like, what do you got for me today? And he's getting so much better. And the other guys are like, I know, I know, I know. I'm like. Stop saying. I know. Like, show me by doing it and just shut up and listen so I can coach up. Yep. But so yeah, I, I really liked the Spark framework. I didn't know there was an a, an adult version, but

Arthur: 44:28

yeah.

Ben: 44:29

I've read Seven Habits of Highly Successful People. Yeah, yeah. I've also read Seven Habits of Highly Successful Teens. Teens. That one's more accessible for me, so maybe I'll just stick with the teenage one because that's who I hang out with the most. Yeah. But, um, just a couple of brief thoughts, like here we are. This podcast will probably, this might not come out until like November, which so. Everyone listening already knows this, but we've been talking about the book Leadership and Self-Deception. Have you ever read that?

Arthur: 45:05

Oh no I haven't. I'm familiar with it though. Yeah,

Ben: 45:08

I love that book. It's fantastic. Uh, your teen is not gonna wanna read Leadership and Self-Deception, so if you're thinking for like stalking stuffers this year, like this book, I'm pretty sure would fit in a stocking. Yeah. You get this handsome picture of Arthur C. Woods on the back. Yeah. This is a book, like I wouldn't just give it to your child. I'm sure we've all gotten books before for Christmas that we have never read. We've never intended on reading, and I would hate for this to be one of those type of gifts. We're just checking a box, like did we fill up the stocking? I don't know. Stick a book in there. It'll make it look full. I would give this with some purpose and for me if I want my kids to do something. I feel like it's my job as a parent. So in addition to doing life coaching, I'm also a solar salesman. I'm really good at selling stuff and the important thing about selling stuff, I never want to like turn into the used car salesman. That's like trying to twist someone's arm to get something that they later regret. Yeah. My job as a salesman is to help you understand what you want. Have the resourcefulness to get what you want. And as a parent, and back when I was a high school teacher and then a high school principal, I got really good. Like, my job is to sell you on this thing. And if I have to include some perks and some bells and whistles, I'm going to, and this could be the type of gift where I give it to my kid Hughes and I'm like, look, I didn't wanna force this book on you. If I'm not willing to read it, so I've read it. I think it's fantastic. I didn't write down any answers in the question section, right. And I'm gonna leave that blank for you. But you could totally bribe your child with dinner at their favorite restaurant with Sure Dessert. When you're done reading this thing and that way we can sit down and discuss it. And I'd

Arthur: 47:25

read, I'd read any book for a free dinner at my favorite restaurant.

Ben: 47:28

So you come to Utah and you read Leadership and Self-Deception. I'll take you out to dinner and we'll just talk about, all right, let's do it.

Arthur: 47:36

Yeah. Are you paying for my flight out? I didn't. What are the details of this? Just dinner.

Ben: 47:40

But I, we'll take you to this Brazilian Steakhouse. It's my favorite

Arthur: 47:45

dude, that it's not Fogo de Chow is it?

Ben: 47:47

No, but that sounds,

Arthur: 47:48

oh, it's a, my favorite restaurant is a Brazilian steakhouse.

Ben: 47:52

Yeah. This one's called Tacos. Okay. And they're like, bring your food out on like a, on a skewer. Yeah. Yeah, dude. Hey. Well, you get yourself out here. I'll take you to dinner. How's that? All right. All right. And we'll discuss this book and leadership and self deception sounds. Sounds good. Leadership and self deception. The Arbinger Institute, they've never been on my podcast. You have twice now. So obviously we know which book I prefer.

Arthur: 48:23

Clearly, clearly.

Ben: 48:26

But, um, tell us, if we wanted to get this book for our teens, how would we go about doing that?

Arthur: 48:36

Yeah, probably the easiest way would just be to go to Spark for emerging leaders.com. Spark for emergency leaders, not emergency emerging leaders.com. And that'll take you right to the, the book. And then, obviously if you want to connect with me or talk about coaching or whatever, I'm just@arthurcwoods.com.

Ben: 48:58

Arthur C. Woods, c woods.com, Arthur C Chocolate.

Arthur: 49:05

I don't think that's my middle name. Alright, let's check Charles, as a matter of fact, is my middle name, Arthur Charles Woods. And if you must know, I am the second

Ben: 49:14

God dang. And I was hoping it was the third.

Arthur: 49:16

Yeah,

Ben: 49:17

the second is pretty cool. But that's just junior. The third. No, that's legit.

Arthur: 49:25

No, people, people get, get angry about this because the, because Roman numeral two is on my birth certificate. I am not Arthur C. Woods Jr. I'm Arthur C. Woods the second. Yeah. So you, you know, there's nothing wrong with being Junior, but that ain't my name. So Yeah.

Ben: 49:45

Thanks. I, I think you should add the second to everything you do. Like that would add more weight to it. Like not just, this isn't just Arthur Seawood. It's, it's the second one, Arthur C. Woods the second.

Arthur: 50:03

It's not just the crummy first one. Exactly. Although the first one was my dad. I just called him crummy. So that's not what I mean. He is not crummy. Yeah.

Ben: 50:14

and so you also speak, have you ever spoken in Utah?

Arthur: 50:18

I have not gotten out to Utah. No. No. Geez. But yeah, I get to, I get to speak and teach a lot, do different conferences and, and camps and. some small business training and all sorts of fun stuff. So I, I love doing the coaching. I love doing the one-on-one virtual coaching, but I also just love getting in the car and, and driving or flying to a location to, to get, to speak at a conference or, or lead a workshop or that kind of thing. Yeah, it's one of my favorite things I get to do.

Ben: 50:47

I would love to come speak with you someday. You know how I let you hijack my podcast? Like you should just let me come hijack a speech and engagement someday.

Arthur: 50:58

That would work actually. That'd be fun. And, and for all the, the times you and I have talked, we have yet to meet in person and I feel like that one of these days that's gonna have to happen.

Ben: 51:08

Where are you? You're in Kentucky, right? Or Pennsylvania? Pennsylvania. Pennsylvania. So close.

Arthur: 51:14

Yeah.

Ben: 51:15

Probably not really close, but Pennsylvania, I've never been to Pennsylvania,

Arthur: 51:20

I've never been to Utah,

Ben: 51:21

so yeah, we should change that. But the most, the thing that would make the most sense to me, we should go meet in the middle somewhere, like

Arthur: 51:30

probably wouldn't be that far.

Ben: 51:31

Remember the old country song? You start walking my way, I'll start walking Yours. We'll meet in the middle. Right in the middle. Yeah. But then it doesn't check. It'll probably be in like Missouri or something. I've been there a million times. We gotta check off Utah, off of your state list and Pennsylvania off of mine, so.

Arthur: 51:51

Oh, that's true. Yeah.'cause I've been in Missouri a bunch of times as well, so. Yeah. Have you ever check off,

Ben: 51:58

have you ever been to Silver Dollar City?

Arthur: 52:00

I have, yeah. Yeah, yeah,

Ben: 52:02

yeah. I, so I have some clients in Missouri. I've toyed with the idea of doing a live event in southern Missouri somewhere and like, I don't know, renting jet skis and going and doing fun stuff and then maybe spending a day in, Branson. We should do that sometime. I That would be fun.

Arthur: 52:26

Yeah.

Ben: 52:26

Good excuse to hang out

Arthur: 52:29

that, that would be super cool. In fact, my sister-in-law works at Silver Dollar City. What she does, she does costuming for their shows.

Ben: 52:38

Oh, wows a small world. Well, it is. I don't actually know your sister-in-law. I just know her place of employment. But still small world. Yeah. Okay. Well. Arthur, thank you so much for coming and hanging out with me. You are a fantastic man. One of my theories on, I talk about this a lot in football coaching, it applies to life coaching as well in football coaching. There are a lot of football coaches that know football really well. Unfortunately, a lot of them still act like teenagers and yeah, for as good a football coach as they are, they're not. A good coach in terms of like being a high quality. Human being that you'd actually want your son to grow up and be like that person. Yeah. And Arthur, I can vouch for you as a life coach because based on who trained you like, you better be amazing. No, that's exactly right. I don't know that I trained him as much as he gave me credit for in the beginning, but I do know what a good man you are and that principle of proximity, if. You or your teen could spend time with Arthur, I promise you he will have a positive impact in your life. So that's super nice. Yeah, super nice and true. He's not even paying me to say that, but Arthur, let's stay in touch. I do have a birthday coming up and I haven't had anyone take over my podcast in a while, so maybe we should work something out.

Arthur: 54:11

Yeah, that'd be cool.

Ben: 54:13

Okay, and is your website like arthur c woods.com or something com

Arthur: 54:18

Arthur c woods.com. That's exactly right.

Ben: 54:20

Not Arthur C. Woods The second, just Arthur C. He shares that one with his dad. It's my daddy's website. Okay, well we better let the good people go. But yeah, spark for Emerging Leaders. I highly recommend it. I enjoyed it. Starting with the story the way it did with a young man. Yeah. Instantly had me engaged.'cause I'm like, dang. I know how that feels. So get it for your teens. Perfect stocking stuffer. And sweeten the pie. Sweeten the pot by like making it worth your teen's while to read it. So I love that. I love that.

Arthur: 55:02

Take'em to a Brazilian steakhouse.

Ben: 55:03

Yeah, don't worry. It's only gonna cost you 35 to 40 bucks plate. Yeah, don't worry

Arthur: 55:08

about

Ben: 55:08

that. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Well, Arthur, thank you for being here. And those of you listening, come back next week. We'll be right back at it.

Arthur: 55:19

Thanks, Ben.